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I would like to share an Idea here with SCN design and moderator team.


Putting this forward as a blog as this is just my view point and many fellow SCNer could share their ideas.

Many new people who have just joined/relatively new to SCN could have got a feeling to have a separate space for novice.

There would be many instances, people get many doubts in the new technology area they started to work. Sometimes, it is tough to search in the community and find an answer for what they are looking for as they are not yet familiar with the terminologies and technology. SCN could save to some extent here with the an awesome new design and search functionality. A simple appreciation is definitely not enough to the team who have put in their efforts here.

But if a person fail to find the information what they are looking for and post a question in regular forums, it would be straight away rejected by moderators.

Most of the questions which a newbie get looks silly for other experience folks in the community and hence SCN has strict rules of engagement to maintain the quality of the content. I do respect SCN rules of engagement. We shouldn’t post silly questions which might not add any value to the community.

But, how about having a separate space for novice say “Novice corner” where a newbie can post their big issues (Which is obviously silly for others πŸ™‚ ). This area would be like a sandbox system.

Point system can be altered as below to avoid any exploitation.

1. Anybody can answer any question.

2. Points can be rewarded to only people having lifetime points of certain threshold limit (Say 200). For others, point system can be grayed out.

3. Number of points for helpful answer could be 2 and for correct answer could be 5.

This way, experience people who really want to help their new buddies can still answer the questions but without expecting any points πŸ˜‰ .

This approach also helps relatively experience folks to start answering these small questions and start their SCN reward point journey. Many times, these guys won’t get a chance to answer in regular forums as many experience folks are rapid enough to solve any damn problem in this world. Big thanks to the experts to take out time from their busy schedules and help others… 😎

If this doesn’t sound crazy, a beta version can be tested in high volume areas like ABAP development space.

Hope this idea wouldn’t be taken as offensive against community guidelines and valuable feed back is much appreciated.

Link for voting this Idea if you like πŸ˜‰

https://ideas.sap.com/ct/ct_a_view_idea.bix?c=8A060447-ED55-41EB-905E-C077161D66AC&idea_id=052AE4BA-45DD-4659-9DC6-414AEFC13692

Change: 07/11/2013

Replaced the word Fresher with Novice. Never realized that, there is no word called “Fresher” though it is extensively used in India πŸ™

Thanks guys for notifying this.

Thanks,

Vinod.

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63 Comments

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  1. Raman Korrapati

    Thanks for sharing your idea. As per your idea SCN may need implement for all forums. . If they do simple search they(freshers) can get what they need. Let’s wait and see other comments. Please post your idea at scn idea space.

    Thanks

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  2. JΓΌrgen L

    Certainly not a bad idea. Such sandbox was already there in SDN. It wasn’t possible with the new platform as you could make points in any space. I think this could be agian an option when SCN can make certain spaces points free (compare with discussions in the Coffee Corner space).

    But what is actually a fresher? I had today a Topaz level fresher in MM, not sure when he made this Topaz level and in which forum.

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  3. Benedict Venmani Felix

    I agree, on one thing that freshers dont get a chance to answer a question because there is some experienced folk who has already answered it and our newbie just ends up posting comments like “you can do as XXX says its a good idea”:)

    I think the more mature members can just refrain themselves from answering every single question and save their expertise for the really difficult questions:) , so that the new comers/learners can get some satisfaction on their participation. But you cannot make this a hard rule.

    I do not agree, on fresher wanting to post so called silly questions 😐 . Almost every question that needs an answer is already availale in SCN. They need to do their homework in searching properly. Read multiple discussions and documents etc.

    I am neutral, about the gamifiaction/point system. Even though it has increased the participation, it has greatly brought down the quality of documents.

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  4. Custodio de Oliveira

    Hi Vinod,

    Thanks for writing this.

    I honestly don’t think the points systems needs to be changed. Take the example of Arindam Mondal. He’s got all but 6 of his points this year, and is already a top 10 contributor in the ABAP space (nice  job BTW πŸ˜‰ )

    Cheers,

    Custodio.

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    1. Arindam Mondal

      Points or no points, I think what counts is participation.. πŸ˜‰ rather more getting to know all members and learning from them is even better.. πŸ™‚ . I wasn’t into answering questions even though been a member since its starting days..(when it was called SDN) πŸ˜€ . May be I was busy learning from all mentors in online forums (SCN/SDN and outside) as well as in the real world mentors(learning on the job as they say πŸ™‚ )..

      I think there is a way in the forum which i suggested in one of my discussions long back.. was, if you think its a easy question start a discussion not a question…(kind of takes away the point scoring part but still helps the person get a reasonable answers or pointers)

      Also, there is so much to refer to in many different places(even outside SCN πŸ˜€ ) as all mentors and forum regulators suggest from time to time.( As also mentioned in the ‘”Search before posting” point of the forum rules.)

      Cheers,

      Arindam

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      1. Custodio de Oliveira

        Hi Arindam,

        I’m not saying you are doing this for points. I’m just saying that even someone who just started contributing can quickly climb in the points ranking so there’s no need to change the system.

        Keep the good work.

        Cheers,

        Custodio

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  5. Sharmi G

    Hi vinod,

    its a very good idea…your idea help a lot to fresher..and I also  dos’t believe in points system…..our main focus is sharing and gaining knowledge….

    thanks,

    sharmistha

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  6. Srinivas Salpala

    Vinod,

    Great through…..! In my opinion, seniors can gather any kind of assistance from various sources but the real need and help should be always avail to freshers and beginners.

    We hope this will become a reality soon and all beginners will benefit from the forum.

    BR, Srinvias Salpala

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  7. Vinod Vemuru Post author

    Hello All,

    Thanks a lot for the true feedback and comments. Let us wait and see what other moderators say.

    Regarding point system, I too believe learning and helping should be the motive than gaining points. But whether we agree or not, participation has been tremendously increased due to point system and at the same time, quality of content in some cases is going down.

    But, moderators are putting their best efforts to avoid/remove low quality content. This step is absolutely necessary. If not done, same junk would come up in search results as well which makes it tough to find good answers/solutions through search.

    I understand this is not a small task for the team to redesign the things. As I said, ABAP development would be the right space to do R&D on beta version (if possible) where most of the rejections would be happening. Let us see how it goes.

    Thanks,

    Vinod.

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  8. Jason Lax

    I like this idea and the proposal you have for how to manage who can participate.  I disagree that it be a single catch-all Freshers Space lest it become a second coffee corner or dumping ground for stuff: it should be split into main topic areas such as ABAP, ERP, etc. I also think that it should be discussions only: no blog posts, no documents.

    ➕ SCN has been consolidating all ideas on SAP Idea Place.  For your suggestion to move forward (or in any direction), you must create a new idea there so that other members can vote on it.  Go to SCN Innovation and Enhancements to get started.

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    1. Vinod Vemuru Post author

      Thanks Jason. I came to know about idea and innovation space yesterday after creating this Blog πŸ™‚

      I was away from SCN for couple of years and joined back just few weeks back. Still exploring the new design 😎

      Yes. I do agree, we need not have blogs/documents in this zone. This should work only for discussions/questions. But I am bit skeptical about participation if point system is completely removed. Everyone may not think in a matured way specially the ones who has recently started their career. It would come by experience any way πŸ˜‰

      Thanks,

      Vinod.

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      1. Jason Lax

        I have no qualms with enabling points in these spaces and your suggestion to reduce the amounts could prevent abuses. Perhaps some senor members of the community could also be enlisted to keep an eye on the fresher spaces.

        Let us know when your idea is available so we can have a chance to vote on it.

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      1. Jason Lax

        I just did some more checking.  Seems like it’s a British word for a first year student at university. However, I think it also applies to recent grads aswell in the context mentioned above.

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  9. Rahul Mahajan

    Hi Vinod,

    Thanks for posting this idea!

    Idea is good but then when and how and who will decide a person X is no more fresher or is still a fresher.

    But if a person fail to find the information what they are looking for and post a question in regular forums, it would be straight away rejected by moderators.

    Most of the questions which a fresher get looks silly for other experience folks in the community and hence SCN has strict rules of engagement to maintain the quality of the content.

    I did not find a link but somebody already posted long back saying that before posting a question (whatever it may be) one should do following things.

            1) Try to read F1 help (most of the time small issues get solved here)

            2) Seek some help from team lead or peers

            3) Search on SCN (somebody already faced same issue and answered also)

            4) Google it out

            5) Post a question

    I am sure if a person (whatever experience level) follows this approach, his/her questions may not get rejected directly.

    This is my personal opinion and may not be 100% correct. Just thought to put what I felt on this.

    Thanks,

    Rahul

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  10. Jitendra Kansal

    When I joined SCN as a FRESHER I used to read and analyze already posted threads, blogs, docs. To be very honest I never found difficulty in searching for any solution if I had stuck in between.

    But yes its good idea and its upto moderators how they can implement it.

    Rgrds,

    Jitendra

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  11. Krish Lak

    Good idea but sometimes it is difficult to classify a q as a beginer or experienced. So if i have a q and i post it in geenral forum, will it be removed straight away or moved to Freshers forum?

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  12. smruti ranjan dash

    I too agree..

               “Here rich become richer and fresher remain as fresher”.hope this blog will stay tuned otherwise it will may be discarded in few movement.

    thanks

    ranjan

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    1. Vinod Vemuru Post author

      Main intention behind this idea is to have a separate platform for freshers but not for gaining points. Many people asking who can be considered as a fresher. I would say a fresher would be any one who is new to a technology or a specific area in a technology.

      SAP is a huge platform. I can best describe my case as an example. I have a total SAP experience of about 6.5 years. But when I changed my module from ABAP to FICO, definitely i would be fresher in FI but good at/an experienced person in ABAP.

      So, there is no specific definition for fresher/expert. It all depends on how comfortable a person is in a technology πŸ˜†

      Apologies if it hurts anyone’s feelings…This is just my view point.

      Thanks,

      Vinod.

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  13. Varun Kumar Sahu

    Hi Vinod,

    Indeed a great and wonderful idea for freshers! Would support you and your idea. Would be great if it becomes reality.

    Thanks & Regards,

    Varun Kumar Sahu

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  14. Rajneesh Saxena

    Vinod Sir

    GE

    Your Idea is very good . But at the same time don’t you think that the persons entering (asking or discussing) in suggested area will get confused with each other. Means if I have solved a particular issue without experiencing its consequences I will suggest to others to do so, don’t you think it will worsen the situation and the people participating (asking) may go in more troubles.

    Now let us discuss what is a fresher? Sir, I am also a fresher to SAP. And I believe that for me one life is not enough to become a master in SAP (It is so vast). As Mr. Jurgen L said in his comment “I had today a Topaz level fresher in MM” is correct. Because what I feel, till the date we don’t face a particular issue in SAP we are fresher to it.

    With high regards

    Rajneesh Saxena

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    1. Vinod Vemuru Post author

      Thanks a lot Rajneesh for the Honest feedback. Sorry. I couldn’t understand below statement.

      Means if I have solved a particular issue without experiencing its consequences I will suggest to others to do so, don’t you think it will worsen the situation and the people participating (asking) may go in more troubles.

      Getting a solution in SCN doesn’t mean that they don’t analyze any further. Sometimes, people are getting disappointed in initial days of their career itself as they are restricted to get help. This area should work like a sandbox system. Also, people having little knowledge, can’t answer most of the questions as it is already answered by experts. This would further demotivate people to be active in SCN.

      Coming to the word fresher, it is never decided based on number of points in SCN πŸ™‚

      Points definitely is not the reflection of one’s knowledge level. There are so many people with very few points. But, they might be champs in the area they are working. This hold good vice versa.


      Some people might be fast to sail out from difficulties and some may need assistance.

      I have seen many freshers put into good implementation projects. Due to lack of time, knowledge, they end up suggesting non reliable solutions to the clients. This area would help such people till they are comfortable on using SAP and how to approach to find a good solution. Imagine you are put in to some alien technology and asked to deliver something by EOD.

      Other important point I feel is, Quality of freshers coming in to the industry is drastically reduced compared to past. Any one agree with me?

      Sorry if this hurt anyone.

      Thanks,

      Vinod.

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  15. Roberto Vidotti

    Hi Vinod,

    ok with the sandbox idea, i just have doubts about points because it could be another easy way for points-gaming like actually CC.

    Ok for a point free space.

    Regards

         Roberto

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    1. Vinod Vemuru Post author

      Hi Roberto,

      Thanks Roberto for the feedback.

      As I said, points can be awarded to only people who have very less life time points say 250 or 500. After this limit, we can still answer questions but no points. Point free space was already in my mind. But, I was afraid of participation.

      Thanks,

      Vinod.

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  16. Krish Lak

    Hi

       I have a suggestion to make this forum more lively and reward members appropriately.

    If i post a question and if a member replies to me asap or within 3 days then they should get some bonus points- this doenst mean just replying to the question but suggesting a valuable idea or ask some sensible question related to the issue which will enable other forum members to help with the issue posted.

    Do you think by awarding bonus points it will encourage everyone to answer a question or help with an issue?

    Thanks

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    1. Vinod Vemuru Post author

      Hi krish,

      Idea sounds good. But, I wonder if this works in SCN. Because, most of the cases, people do reply with in 4-5 hours. And in majority cases, it solves the issues also.

      SCN point system itself is being questioned by many experts raising concerns about content quality. But, definitely it helped to boost participation. This Idea is under review with SCN team. Let us see how they take it further!

      Anyways, I suggest you to submit this idea in Idea zone πŸ™‚

      Thanks,

      Vinod.

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    2. JΓΌrgen L

      I see much to much asap

      And giving bonus points for quick replies will just accelerate the increase of non-quality content.

      I see it everyday, people rush into an answer quicker than others read the question. Replies are posted based on the subject, they could not have read the questions nor understood them properly, and so it often turns out that the reply does not fit to the question.

      This is actually very annoying for the person who asked the question, and it discourages others to post a valuable well thought-out answer.

      Like many questions which just come as one-liner, the answers are just being one-dimensional

      There is no room and time to understand and explain a complexity.

      This might work for somebody who is playing IDES, but it is naive to think that this is an professional approach, and that the real business world works like this.

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      1. Vinod Vemuru Post author

        Yes Jurgen. You are correct. Many times it is really annoying to go through entire chain to see if others has already replied with what we want to reply! If we don’t find proper reply, it wastes many people time to read through the chain.

        Thanks,

        Vinod.

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  17. Jo Spencer

    In my opinion…

    If we are going to help beginners in SAP, shouldn’t we start with the fact that there are no such words as “freshers” and “upgradation” in the English language – using them in a business climate will make people think you have poor English skills and won’t be able to communicate effectively.  Also, calling someone you do not know and are not close to “dear” is slightly offensive.

    That being said, SAP really isn’t a place for noobs at least on the technical side.  A good BASIS person needs to know and understand at least the basics database, system networking, and technical support PLUS SAP BASIS.  I just don’t see how you can teach all that is a beginner.

    As I said, it is my opinion but I ran the SAP support websites called sapsuperusers.com and uber-goobers.com.  If you need proof I know what I am talking about, go to sapfans.com and pull up all the oldsapguru posts – that is me.  πŸ™‚

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  18. Suman Sardar

    Hi Vinod,

    Thanks for putting your innovative idea.But I do not know how this can be managed if there is no such control of this forum.Anyways SCN team can think of it and as we all know they know better.

    But sometimes me too fell the same that our newbie ask the query and their post is rejected as they are not fully aware and familiar but it is also true that all newbies are gradually become an expert by the entire process so it is always not be very spoon feeding help to the new user to support.I think they have to be very consistent as they want to become an SAP expert so getting things very easily they can also lost the mindset.

    But somehow in between to make it simple like Moderator will always refer the points they should follow also The Rules of Engagement may have some sub document with simple example to make them understand in their early stage.

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    1. Steffi Warnecke

      Yeah, but IMO that’s more a problem of not reading the space description or looking at the other threads in the space or not using the search and looking at the space the found threads are located in. πŸ˜‰

      A playground for new SAP users and soon-to-be-admins won’t help with that problem I fear.

      Regards,

      Steffi.

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  19. Suseelan Hari

    Hi Vinod,

    Good Day!

    I appreciate your ideas. I think there is no need to give any points for Novice corner if they create and anybody can post any ideas there. It will be good to understand about SCN Rules, Features, Do’s & Donts, Advantages and so on. I suggest you to post some more ideas in SAP Idea place too. Thanks for sharing. Keep it up! πŸ™‚

    Regards,

    Hari Suseelan

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